POLITICS CORNER

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Tizer » 09 Jun 2019, 15:55

Yes, it was good to be away from Brexit and Trump. We had some good weather but Tuesday and Friday were heavy rain. We spent Tuesday in Truro visiting the Cathedral (mainly to look at the wonderful range of building stones used) and drooling over the Rashleigh mineral collection in the Royal Cornwall Museum, plus various shops. On Friday it was constant rain and very gusty winds and we didn't get outside for a walk until 8.30 in the evening - not a good day for walking a cliff top! Other days were good and we enjoyed some beautiful scenery. Fantastic views from a walk to the top of St Agnes Beacon. Heathland around the old mines is in full flower at the moment and there's a marvellous variety of wild flowers which benefit from the mine pollution preventing colonisation with shrubs. A carpet of yellow, blue and pink flowers. Mrs Tiz is a walking encyclopaedia on wild flowers (her mum was a botanist) and she was reeling off the names as we walked by them. We spent more time looking at the flowers than at the mines! :smile:

Oh, and on D-Day we saw and heard what we think was a Mustang pass overhead and that was a reminder of the significance of that day in 1944. Americans were billeted near St Agnes.

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Whyperion » 09 Jun 2019, 22:57

Gove was reported as wanting to replace VAT with a simple (lower) sales tax. Presumably any Brexit cash out saving will cover tresury shortfall if the tax is lowe ? Has he never operated a VAT system - while it is generally straightforward the exemptions withing education, charity , and health in the main cause a number of complex issues that I dont think would be resolved by a GST type tax.

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Stanley » 10 Jun 2019, 03:04

Boris must be delighted at the trouble Gove has been landed in by the serialising of the biography in the Times. It certainly dominated the news yesterday particularly the questioning about the US visa!
I remember a Jewish lady I know telling me that one of her ancestors got into serious trouble at Ellis Island when she misheard the question about was her intention to overthrow the American government. It delayed her entry for a long time.
Boris shouldn't crow too much about Gove's troubles, there are rich pickings in the past for anyone who decides to do a character assassination on him starting with this....

Image

Question is, when does he expose himself to a searching interview?

We should get to know today how many contenders fail the test of support amongst the 11 already declared and there are some latecomers expected.
I wonder what our quondam PM is doing to pass the time...... Mind you I suppose that description is inaccurate as technically she is still PM. Confusing isn't it..... No firm date for the removal van yet!
Later.... Boris has written an article for the Telegraph revealing that he is going to raise the threshold of the highest rate of tax from £50,000 to £80,000, one in ten of taxpayers. Absolute red meat for the Tories in the Shires and very expensive. He says it can be financed by higher National Insurance and money set aside to cope with No Deal. This is of course grossly regressive and unfair.
Time Boris was quizzed about all this!
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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by plaques » 10 Jun 2019, 07:56

Stanley wrote:
10 Jun 2019, 03:04
Boris ... revealing that he is going to raise the threshold of the highest rate of tax from £50,000 to £80,000,
What a good wheeze, Bribe the Tory MPs who could vote for you with a nice tax break that someone else has to pay for. OPM (other people's money) Also with the promise that come a general election the same promise will apply to traditional Tory voters. I will believe this when I see it in writing on the side of a bus.

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Stanley » 10 Jun 2019, 08:17

I agree with you P. See THIS BBC report. £9.6billion a year could go a long way with the poor who have been hit hardest by Austerity but what's the Tory take on this? Give it to our rich voters.....
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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Whyperion » 10 Jun 2019, 08:47

Johnson's Tax Idea has a net shortfall to the treasury of £9.6bn pa. The NI I think is from upping the £50K to £80K on earnings rather than an accross the board employees NI Item, but it expands the problem of tax of 'income' (*) and 'earnings'. Quite simply though there are people , mainly in London and the South East on earnings in excess of £50k that the petty reductions in Child Benefit, Childcare Support make the marginal effort of overtime - particulary for higher paid medical staff and technical engineers in civils , electricals and mechanicals, hardly worth the doing. What is needed is a reform of the tax, benefits system that really does support families, those in need and remains participatory for all residents of the UK, along with better reform of pensions - a reducing back of pension age and some changes to the taxation on values of pension pots which kick in far too soon compared to the amount that might be needed to see a person through 30 odd years of older age might be better priorities in getting a balance of income to the government and income to the person.

With no NI differential on savings / investments income there will be quite large advantages for investors - though for many the annual income is unlikely to be achieved, I would not over worry though tory voters might want to conside if they want brexit 'savings' to go to the NHS or what.

Personally for the quickest win to the UK economy I would trim Employer NHI Contributions by 1% and reduce VAT by 5% on most items over the course of a parliament.

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Tizer » 10 Jun 2019, 08:48

The fact that Boris is reckoned to be the most likely next PM and that he wants to give more money to the rich would surely make a general election win easy for Labour...or is Labour now so divided and introspective that it would miss the opportunity?

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by PanBiker » 10 Jun 2019, 08:51

Chance would be a fine thing Tiz. Tories are hanging on by their fingernails using the fixed term ploy, bugger the option of a democratic vote.
Ian

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by chinatyke » 10 Jun 2019, 11:02

What Ian wrote about his driving licence saga made me realise what a controlled society you live in. From cradle to grave! Time for Tooting Popular Front to rise again.

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Big Kev » 10 Jun 2019, 11:43

chinatyke wrote:
10 Jun 2019, 11:02
What Ian wrote about his driving licence saga made me realise what a controlled society you live in. From cradle to grave! Time for Tooting Popular Front to rise again.
How does the UK compare with China (the country) for controlling society?
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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by chinatyke » 10 Jun 2019, 12:18

Kev, personally I've honestly never felt freer and safer and I've been here 15 years. As an example, we're supposed to carry our passports with us at all times; I never do, and I've never once been stopped and asked to show it. Censoring of the internet is about the only thing that affects me and usually takes the form of unreachable websites. This has been very noticeable for the last 2 weeks because of the 30th anniversary of a controversial Beijing event, even though that event was officially commemorated in Hong Kong.

The country is governed differently and controlled like any other law abiding society. I feel the government is acutely aware of the people and their needs and it looks after them. Perhaps I'm lucky that I'm experiencing these good times, I know it hasn't always been like this.

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Tripps » 10 Jun 2019, 12:51

China - it's a joy to have you on the site. I see however that you cannot publicly name the 'Beijing event' openly.

I can say 'Peterloo' without consequences. :smile:
Born to be mild. . .

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by chinatyke » 10 Jun 2019, 13:00

Tripps wrote:
10 Jun 2019, 12:51
China - it's a joy to have you on the site. I see however that you cannot publicly name the 'Beijing event' openly.

I can say 'Peterloo' without consequences. :smile:
Yep, I don't want to attract the attention of the censors. Actually, I've often heard it said that there will be a file kept somewhere on all individual foreigners by Big Brother. Whether that is true or not I couldn't say. I've nothing to hide so I don't worry about it.

If you get bored you can try calling a copper 'a pig' or a person of 'BAME' heritage by another name and see how much freedom of speech you have!

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Big Kev » 10 Jun 2019, 13:23

chinatyke wrote:
10 Jun 2019, 12:18
Kev, personally I've honestly never felt freer and safer and I've been here 15 years. As an example, we're supposed to carry our passports with us at all times; I never do, and I've never once been stopped and asked to show it.
What would the consequences be if you were stopped and asked to show it?
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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by chinatyke » 10 Jun 2019, 14:27

Big Kev wrote:
10 Jun 2019, 13:23
chinatyke wrote:
10 Jun 2019, 12:18
Kev, personally I've honestly never felt freer and safer and I've been here 15 years. As an example, we're supposed to carry our passports with us at all times; I never do, and I've never once been stopped and asked to show it.
What would the consequences be if you were stopped and asked to show it?
There isn't likely to be any consequences provided you do have a passport with a valid residence permit or visa in it, and police accommodation registration (certifies where you are living). I would expect to be questioned by the police and possibly be made to produce it. It would be like a Chinese person not carrying their ID card, a trivial thing as far as I can ascertain. You can get away with carrying a photocopy but I don't bother unless I am travelling out of town.
Actually I'm still registered as living in Nanning because the police in Pingguo are very laid back and refused to register me saying "it doesn't matter so long as you are registered in Nanning", in other words we're not interested. I have an apartment in Nanning and so I use that address on my official documents.

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Tizer » 10 Jun 2019, 15:56

Life in the UK is not always as free and easy as we would like it to be. Take for example the trained nurses who have come here from non-EU countries to work in our hospitals (we currently need 30,000 more nurses according to official figures). Many are now giving up and returning home because they've been working here for 9 months or more as nannies or waiters/waitresses while waiting for permission to work here. They are already fully trained in their own countries but have to wait for an opportunity to take a test for which they are charged over £1,700.

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Whyperion » 10 Jun 2019, 17:11

chinatyke wrote:
10 Jun 2019, 11:02
What Ian wrote about his driving licence saga made me realise what a controlled society you live in. From cradle to grave! Time for Tooting Popular Front to rise again.
The Driving Licence is more cock-up than plan. The rules quite rightly protect large numbers of individuals from a thoughtless action by one individual. that the change given by HM Government for permission to drive on HM (The King's / The Public) Highway sometimes acts slow is a function of funding, and an ensurance that the correct outcome is achieved. Frustrating for the individual, but think of the public outcry if DVLA -re-granted licence by means of an error and one or more persons suffered as a result. That perhaps the insurance terms should reflect cover to cover ' reasonably likely to have permission to drive at the time following a medical revocation or suspension'' term might be useful to have.

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Whyperion » 10 Jun 2019, 17:14

The UK might be short of generalist and specialist nurses (and I know a few from around the world currently working in anything from physiotherapy , community and mental health areas for example), this has in part been a failed consideration to properly encourage and train the young - and not so young- to enter the profession by both past labour and current tory adminstrations.

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Stanley » 11 Jun 2019, 02:45

Sorry but we are off piste. What's really important at the moment is that we have a Tory politician promising to give his constituency a kick back if they vote for him even though he knows full well he could never get away with it. I can give you similar arguments against all the other candidates.
Our real and present problem is that we have a 19th century political structure failing to deal with 21st century realities. In the next six weeks approximately 110,000 blue rinse and pearls reactionaries and their families will decide who our PM is going to be at a time when the last thing we need is a rosy coloured assertion that England can rule the world again. (Note England, this is all about English Tory politics.)
We must keep our heads... More sense is talked in this topic by all shades of opinion than in the whole of Parliament. The good men there have either been seduced or silenced.
You all know what my programme would look like and I suspect you would all agree with most of it because it is based on reality and history, not Magic Beans and tradition. Let's concentrate on that!
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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Stanley » 11 Jun 2019, 05:36

Later.... IDS has backed Boris Johnson. What a splendid endorsement, that should make him a shoo-in!
Did I see that Chris Grayling has announced he is backing someone?
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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by plaques » 11 Jun 2019, 07:52

The Prime Minister election fiasco is a good time to bury bad news. The BBC is set to cancel the free TV licence for the over 75s BBC fee a projected saving of £12bn, Now we know who is really going to pay for the tax break for the top earners. This long term time fuse was lit by that good old Tory George Osborne. Those at the bottom paying to support those at the top. 'Compassionate Concervatives' tell me another.

There's still a bunch of Brexit contenders who think that its a good idea to put parliament on holiday until the 31 Oct ( the dead line leaving date ) has been and gone, which cuckoo land do they live in? Of course they may think the holiday ruse has worked OK so far so why don't we give it another try. This is the party we/you have voted to run the country. Never mind we all have mental aberrations and get things wrong but we must try harder next time.

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Tizer » 11 Jun 2019, 11:02

Stanley wrote:
11 Jun 2019, 02:45
Our real and present problem is that we have a 19th century political structure failing to deal with 21st century realities. In the next six weeks approximately 110,000 blue rinse and pearls reactionaries and their families will decide who our PM is going to be at a time when the last thing we need is a rosy coloured assertion that England can rule the world again. (Note England, this is all about English Tory politics.)
We must keep our heads... More sense is talked in this topic by all shades of opinion than in the whole of Parliament. The good men there have either been seduced or silenced.
I would give priority to preventing Brexit. Once out, we can't go back in. Whereas whatever happens in terms of UK politics we can always throw out a bad lot at the next general election. There's still time for a second EU referendum if Parliament gets on with it quickly, or they could always revoke Article 50; Matt Hancock and John Humphrys were wrong this morning when they said there is `no alternative to a deal'. Another thought...why don't we go ahead and hold a second EU referendum in the meantime, anyway? At least then we'd know what the electorate thinks now after 3 years of learning what Brexit will really be like.

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by chinatyke » 11 Jun 2019, 11:59

Tizer wrote:
11 Jun 2019, 11:02
I would give priority to preventing Brexit. Once out, we can't go back in.
Is that true?

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by plaques » 11 Jun 2019, 12:10

chinatyke wrote:
11 Jun 2019, 11:59
Tizer wrote: ↑11 Jun 2019, 12:02
I would give priority to preventing Brexit. Once out, we can't go back in.
Is that true?
No. We could join again but not on the same terms that we enjoy at the moment. Also it would appear that unless we chose an off the shelf membership then a bespoke deal could take quite a long time.

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Stanley » 11 Jun 2019, 12:55

You're right of course, Brexit is an existential risk but I think my point might be that the reason we haven't managed this already is the fact our political system is set up for confrontation and not cooperation. It has been tested to breaking point and proved wanting.
On an entirely separate matter we learn today that both Oxfam and the intelligence services are riddled with corruption of one sort or another. Oxfam's own safeguarding officer warned everyone from her board to the Charities Commission of the problems but was ignored to the point where she resigned in disgust. As far as the safety of data is concerned, Julian Asange begins to look like a paragon of virtue.
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