POLITICS CORNER

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by PanBiker » 02 Apr 2020, 14:04

I will use all means at my disposal to get rid of the Tories when we are allowed to continue the fight. Meanwhile I will continue as a keyboard warrior on social media which has the benefit of built in social distancing.
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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Stanley » 03 Apr 2020, 03:17

I share your anger Ian. They started by lying to us about test numbers and are still doing it but in a weasel way. The only thing they perfect is their response sheets which must be issued to every spokes person as they all use the same language.
The current weasel matter is to confuse the two types of testing and muddy the waters, The grand plan of the super efficient Milton Keynes hub appears to have blown up in their face, Public Health England are surprisingly reticent about it.
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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Tizer » 04 Apr 2020, 09:06

We're hearing questions in the news about why the UK wasn't as quick at blocking the spread of the covid virus as were some other countries. Of course when you look at those other countries they are authoritarian ones such as China, Korea and Singapore. Their governments have greater powers to control their citizens than we do. Germany also has managed to control the spread but they are more self-disciplined than we are. The more liberal countries are less able to control their populations but this difference has become greater in recent times due to the advance of populism, and in the UK especially so since the EU Referendum result. Our politicians passed direct control to the people and now we are seeing the result - populism can't cope with pandemics.

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by PanBiker » 04 Apr 2020, 10:49

So, according to the news it looks like Keir Starmer has taken the ballot to be the next Leader of the Labour Party with Angela Rayner as Deputy Leader.

Not my choice but I do get 50%. We will see how he shapes up and if Angela can keep him in the Socialist groove. It is now incumbent on all members to support the new leadership More important than ever in fact as the Tories have not only screwed the country with Brexit they are now doing the same with their management of the Covid-19 pandemic. Come resumption of the normal democratic process they have to go.

Reaction to Leadership Election - BBC

Not had my email from the Labour Party yet.
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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Tripps » 04 Apr 2020, 13:47

PanBiker wrote:
04 Apr 2020, 10:49
Not my choice but I do get 50%
That's good. Now how does 52% stand? :laugh5:
Born to be mild. . .

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Stanley » 05 Apr 2020, 02:35

" populism can't cope with pandemics."
Tiz, it could be argued that neither can democracy. I have no doubt that arguments are being rehearsed by the neocons 'proving' that socialised medicine failed with Covid19 and it was the private labs that made the running. Untrue of course but that's no bar to use of the argument.
Starmer. I too have no problem with that choice, he always struck me as a safe pair of hands when he was the Labour Shadow on Brexit. He talked what I thought was common sense when the Party/Corbin couldn't get their act together. As Ian pointed out yesterday, it's a good majority and actually better than Corbin's. Let's see how he performs cleaning the stables out.
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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Stanley » 05 Apr 2020, 12:32

Just been listening to Johnny Dimond interviewing George Osborne on midday news. He refused to agree cutting NHS funding and wages was a mistake. He was never asked how much he had made from his job at Black Rock who are making millions out of the crisis. Pussy cat interviews are useless!
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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Stanley » 08 Apr 2020, 05:50

There is no politics at the moment. Covid19 has completely taken over all political processes and the media has not helped by acquiescing in this. Add the fact that the House isn't sitting, Johnson is in Intensive Care and it's Easter and you have a perfect media arena but not one for politics. This is dangerous and should be addressed.
The most 'political' item I have seen this week is the 6 page overview of the Post Office Horizon Scandal in Private Eye If you care about justice or the way our country is managed you should seek this out and read it. It is brilliant investigative reporting and very disturbing.
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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by plaques » 08 Apr 2020, 07:17

Ed Miliband back in Labour's shadow cabinet. I've always rated him as more left-wing than he appears on the surface. Remember that at the time of his leadership half the Labour party's MPs were closeted Conservatives and voters were pinkish or totally disillusioned by Blare's New Labour. Perhaps I'm wrong but it could be a good move on Keir Starmer's part.

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Stanley » 09 Apr 2020, 03:51

You could be right P. It's certainly imaginative.
Switched 3 podium news on last night and got a face full of Sunak telling me what a tough guy Johnson is, turned over immediately to Youtube. A flabby over-privileged man in ICU isn't national news dummy!! How many self-employed are facing eviction is! We even had one MP telling us that BJ plays a mean game of tennis the other night. Am I alone? I don't want to hear that. I want to hear hard facts and make judgements. At the moment this is only possible through back channels like Private Eye....
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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by plaques » 09 Apr 2020, 07:20

Without appearing too callus, talking about Boris is equivalent to throwing a dead cat on the table. As the economy sinks into the sunset and America trying to force its hegemony on us and China taking over total manufacturing industry nobody wants to talk about it. Leaving the EU in today's post pandemic situation is another cliff edge that's being ignored. Getting Brexit done may be exactly what it says on the tin. Getting us done in. Meanwhile the coronovirus has imposed austerity to a level that's never been seen before. How long will it take for those at the bottom of the heap to recover their financial positions they have lost. Better not talk about that. And Boris is sitting up ........

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Stanley » 09 Apr 2020, 08:01

And the EU has (quite rightly) said this morning that it's not up to them if there is an extension, the UK government passed a law banning it so that's where any initiative has to start.
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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Stanley » 11 Apr 2020, 03:52

P, did you see that Boris's father said 'he had taken one for his country'. Is it just me or is this total vapid BS?
I find I am not watching or listening to any news except the radio first thing in the morning. That gives me the flavour and I get enough updates 'accidentally' during the day in my normal listening to keep me abreast.
Basically, there is no politics. The government is so busy covering its arse and explaining how we have the best health service in the world with the best supplies and back up there isn't time to address anything else. If there is we have heard no reports. The bottom line is that years of under-investment in the NHS and its staff by all Parties have brought it to a point where without massive intervention like the 'Nightingale' facilities and cash injections we would be overwhelmed. We can't even keep them supplied with scrubs for God's sake! Never mind esoteric things like adequate supplies of Oxygen and ventilators.
These matters are largely overlooked at the moment but rest assured they will crop up in the future.
As for Brexit and other small matters like that.... Who knows what is happening? All we had the other day was what was obviously a response from the EU to a suggestion from the UK that the EU should offer a longer transition or deadline. The EU response was that as the date was enshrined in UK law, that was where any change had to be initiated. Sounds reasonable but we have heard nothing further. Too busy concentrating on one man in ICU with Flu.....
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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by chinatyke » 11 Apr 2020, 04:44

Stanley wrote:
11 Apr 2020, 03:52
Too busy concentrating on one man in ICU with Flu.....
I doubt if Susan and Mick would agree with your description.

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Stanley » 11 Apr 2020, 05:27

I doubt very much whether Johnson's condition has been at the top of their check list of late! They have been too busy surviving......
Heard Matt Hancock quoted this morning as saying that there was adequate PPE in place. Weasel words, what matters is not whether it exists but whether it is reaching the people who need it. The evidence from the ground is that in many cases it isn't and as usual, anything to do with social care is bottom of the pile. This is the sort of delivery problem that they seem to be struggling with, both in terms of PR and on the ground.
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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by PanBiker » 11 Apr 2020, 10:55

Sally is liaising with a group she has found called Yorkshire Scrubs. they are coordinating delivery to hospitals and care homes that are appealing for extra kit. The main coordinator does a daily update and said yesterday that she had tens of thousands of requests from hospitals, nursing and care homes and the carers who work in the community..
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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Stanley » 11 Apr 2020, 12:07

Later I heard Hancock saying that PPE was a precious resource and suggesting that it has been over-used. (At the same time saying he didn't want to overstress that..... ) Is the man completely out of touch with his department? What matters is that all branches of the service aren't getting the equipment they need. Businesses that have offered help have had no response. All the evidence points to a callous attitude that is letting staff down at the sharp edge.
This man isn't fit to be in charge of a litter of pups never mind the NHS!
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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Stanley » 14 Apr 2020, 03:48

I'm beginning to think we are in more trouble than I thought. That hardly seems possible, a pandemic, a stalled Brexit process and a major economic crisis all happening at the same time and Parliament shut down. How could things get any worse?
Have a look at THIS Wiki biog of Dominic Raab, the man who has come from nowhere and is at the moment de facto deputy for a PM who is in recovery from a severe illness.
It seems to me that he is governing the country by diktat at the moment. This despite the fact that nobody is quite sure who is the ultimate leader, him or Johnson on sick leave at Chequers. There is no sign of any real debate or cooperation between the parties and the media are contributing nothing as they are obsessed with the pandemic.
The pandemic is important, of course it is, but there are other pressing matters of state that need attention and as far as I can see they are being left on one side.
It may be of course that behind the scenes a well oiled and efficient machine is purring away managing the affairs of the country but we have no evidence of this. In fact we have no evidence of anything and that's what is bothering me, we're in mushroom farm country and it is not good enough. We have already seen a suspension of democracy in that there will be no May Council elections. Has National government been cancelled also? Are we now into podium government? I for one need some answers!
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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by plaques » 14 Apr 2020, 07:28

The biggest political decision will have to be addressed in about a months time. Do they start up big business to protect the economy, for that read shareholders and banks, against overwhelming the NHS, for that read killing more of the working population. I can understand their predicament where if you go too far down the line in stopping all business for too long then those at the bottom may get a bit too stroppy and revolution is always a possibility. Robespierre and Lenin are there waiting in the wings.

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Stanley » 15 Apr 2020, 03:30

Little doubt P that in the end they will err on the side of business and income.
It struck me yesterday that if there were any good news stories out there about Sunak's largesse saving businesses or hospitals delighted with deliveries of adequate PPE and testing kits we would be hearing all about them. There don't appear to be any but plenty of stories about firms waiting for treasury decisions on grants, manufacturers waiting to have ventilator designs signed off and small traders finding that the 'grants' are in fact means-tested.
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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by plaques » 15 Apr 2020, 07:21

Amazing isn't it how the GDP economy has been flatlining for almost a year and then after a bit of dislocation from the lockdown will bounce back to the same state of morbidity. Its a good job I don't have a suspicious nature or I would think someone is manipulating the figures.

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Stanley » 15 Apr 2020, 08:12

I think we both know as well as any professional economist that any forecasts made at the moment are about as reliable as fairy dust. But the highly paid statisticians will have to produce something....
Just heard Kier Starmer banging on about holding the government to account over the timetable of lifting the lockdown. Faced with a list of experts who say this is a bad idea he simply said he didn't agree. I think he's wrong and in fact is just looking for a way to get a mention in the news. Far too soon to start getting people thinking about relaxing precautions.
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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Stanley » 16 Apr 2020, 05:22

There is a mounting tide of criticism world wide directed at President Trump on two grounds. First the danger of his seeming to declare that the US has passed the peak and can be 'opened for business'. Second, his threat to stop funding the WHO. In particular the Gates Foundation has gone for his throat, they provide 10% of WHO funding and say it is vital.
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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by plaques » 16 Apr 2020, 07:38

This 7 min by Noam Chomsky is worth listening to. Botched Response. Trump's total failure to understand and react to what is happening can be summarized into sections. (you may need the subtitles switched on)
He ignored warnings that a pandemic was inevitable.
Manufacture of respirators was brought back to America and then the contract cancelled because there wasn't enough profit in it. Leaving them with nothing.
Their health system runs on a minimum average loading to maximise profit. A 'just in time' system where profit is the main factor.
All social budgets are being run down and the pollution industries supported.

I've great respect for Noam Chomsky and I've never heard of anybody offer to take him up on a debate. Considered to be in the world's top IQ people.

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Re: POLITICS CORNER

Post by Stanley » 17 Apr 2020, 03:29

He talks sense P and that defeats the windbags every time.
I find my life is much improved by avoiding all 3 podium 'news'. I pick up scraps that grab my attention during the day. Basically there is no political news at the moment.
[Apart from Rishi Sunak's surprise announcement that the Brexit talks are going well and we are on track for leaving with a deal at the end of the year. How comforting! Did you hear what the Lady in charge of the IMF had to say about that? (LINK)]
Later. Trump says he is opening the US up for business.
The BBC reports that despite Matt Hancock reassuring everyone that PPE is not a problem they are getting requests from hospital trusts for the phone numbers of factories like Burberry who are prepared to make gowns.
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