STATE PENSION

[Stanley]

I recognise all that Ian. It was the personal relationship that made all the difference and both the bank and the customer thrived. You don't get that with a remote centre or a computer that knows nothing about you and can't make judgements. That's why the call centres etc. have to have scripts to parrot from and stick to them rigidly or get sacked.

[PanBiker]

Clock is ticking on my claim for underpaid pension. We are past the seven days and approaching the ten day window for a reply from the DWP. 18th August was the trigger date this time, second go at them. Stuff to do next week then camping so they will get get off the hook for an extra week. No worries it just means they will owe me even more the longer they leave it before a resolution. Ten days is up tomorrow and Monday is a bank holiday so they already have a bit of a get out of jail free card there. When I come back from camping I'll have em if they are attempting to ignore me.

[Stanley]

All part of the general breakdown in provision of public services. What a legacy after ten years of Tory control!
Go for them Ian.

[PanBiker]

No communication, now there's a surprise!

[Stanley]

I was having a conversation with a friend yesterday (Another old wagon driver. My God, how we can bore his neighbour with old war stories!) and he was saying that we pensioners are in the best situation at the moment, no worries about job security and an assured, if low, income. I agreed with him but warned him against being too sanguine about future prospects. If things get half as bad as I suspect they will, all bets may be off.

[Big Kev]

My 'frozen' Railways Pension starts paying out early next year, not a life changing amount but it'll pay for some holidays
Another 5 years before the other 2 'private' pensions kick in and another 7 years for a state pension. I can remember saying 'why do I need to pay into a pension? I'm not old yet'

[Stanley]

The little 'private' pensions are a useful top up Kev. I only have one small one but it makes a big difference to my quality of life. Definitely a good move paying in when I could. (Especially as it increases 3% per annum. )

[PanBiker]

The appeal against the decision of the Judicial Court into the claim of discrimination against 50's women has failed. Just announced this morning. The women are now planning a Supreme court appeal.

I have not had any contact or correspondence yet for my claim of underpayment of pension. This despite two different operatives claiming to have escalated my case and marking it high priority. I will be ringing the DWP for the third time today. I will try not to shout at the unfortunate that takes my call.

[PanBiker]

I rang and was put through quite quickly this time after the required button choices. I got Maria this time who was working from the office rather than from home. She could see my two previous contacts which have not been actioned and agreed that it is not good enough. She has upped the anti and promised a written response within 5 days. My case is now marked as super urgent or some other category that will apparently kick arse!

To be on the safe side she said that if I didn't receive a reply in the next 5 working days I should ring back on the same number but press the buttons for the "change of circumstance team". She said that I was being paid on the New State Pension rate and the only reason that it should be reduced is that if I didn't have enough credits (35) or if I had contracted out at any time. I said I did contract out but still had 42 qualifying credits. More than Sally who will get the full rate so the contracting out clause should not impact my payment.

Five working days and counting, I make that Tuesday or Wednesday next week if I am kind.

[Stanley]

The state of our normal processes like yours is a disgrace Ian and is not getting the attention it deserves because of Covid distraction. Best of luck!

[PanBiker]

Right, I have been quite kind and despite that it would appear that Maria who works for the DWP is a liar as well! Where do they get them all from? I have had Mark, Charlotte and Maria who have all promised to sort me out but have reneged on the agreement. Last time they said it would be five days it is now two weeks yet again with sod all from the DWP! All I want is a reasonable explanation of why I am being paid under the odds. If it's wrong they owe me some brass.

I will be ringing them again today, I will try not to shout.

[Tizer]

Write to one of the newspapers, they love that sort of story, and raise it on social media!

[chinatyke]

She said that I was being paid on the New State Pension rate and the only reason that it should be reduced is that if I didn't have enough credits (35) or if I had contracted out at any time. I said I did contract out but still had 42 qualifying credits. More than Sally who will get the full rate so the contracting out clause should not impact my payment.

If you contract out "at any time" as you have done, does that mean you won't get the full rate regardless of if you have got the full qualifying credits?

Whether or not that is true they should still contact you wih the explanation.

[PanBiker]

No need for the newspapers Tiz, I have spoken to Suzanne. Took a bit of doing though as I checked the DWP number for the Change of Circumstance Department and as far as I was aware pressed all the right buttons offered on the preamble. After 15 minutes I got an answer and was told I was in the wrong department! I had got general pension enquiries who could not help me. They couldn't transfer me either so I had to redial and make different choices. 45 minutes on hold this time with the same 15 seconds of music then "please hold the line" before returning to the same piece of music, repeat ad nauseam. I was loosing the will to live but eventually was answered by Suzanne.

She sounded like a northern lass probably from Leeds or thereabouts. I related my tale and after taking my NI number and answering all the security questions to my total surprise she said, "right, I can work it all out for you and explain how it works". Crack on say I reiterating that I only want a reasonable explanation of why I am being paid under the odds. She accessed my state pension and NI records and then started to explain how the pension payments are calculated.

Apparently all the calculations start with the base line basic pension which is around £119.00 per week. You then get additional pension calculated on rates accrued before 1988 and then an additional amount calculated for contributions after 1988. They add all this together then do the same but starting from the new pension rate. They end up with two figures and you get paid on the best outcome. Now here is the bit that is never explained to you. They make deductions for any other pensions you may be receiving!

In my case she could see that I have an LCC pension and a small monthly remuneration from a Pearl policy I paid a peppercorn amount into for 20 years or so which was converted from an endowment to a small pension payment. I said, hang on a minute. For the Pearl endowment, I paid into that from my earnings after paying tax and NI contributions. So the DWP lost nothing on that. For LCC I had no choice it was linked automatically to my contract. If you work for LCC you pay a small contribution and the council matches it, you get the benefit of a pension when you retire or the pot is paid as redundancy if you lose your job or combination of both. I was made redundant and I took part as a lump sum to pay off my mortgage and the remainder as pension. She explained that you can't have both and that is why I don't get the full rate. She said the payments I made to LCC were deducted from my wage, the LCC contribution was claimed back out of my NI contribution. That is why I have the shortfall.

I said, surely that is not fair, she said, a lot of people think the same when it's explained to them. When you get the calculation figures for your pension none of this is explained fully, she said, they only give the basic figures and you don't get the complete run down unless you ask. She said, it's not really fair but it's the rules that they have to calculate on.

She added that the other folk I had spoken to and failed with do not have the knowledge to work it out for you. Her department is where it all happens, any escalation promised by them should have come to her department. She said, I can print it all out for you if you want and sticjk it in the post, I said yes please. Do you want just the figures or the calculations? I asked for both. I also added that she had been the most helpful person I had spoken with, she thanked me for the compliment.

So there we go, all I ever wanted was an explanation. She has provided that and says she will back it up with the calculations and figures. We shall see. Interesting that she admitted it wasn't fair but was bound by the rules.

[chinatyke]

Well I suppose that is a result even if the outcome isn't what you wanted. I hope they pull out the stops and do a quick job sending the written explanation to you. Now you should send them a bill for your wasted time, Stanley would!

[Stanley]

"Now you should send them a bill for your wasted time, Stanley would!"
Too bloody right China, and by registered post!
Ian, like China I am glad you at last got sense even though it is bad news. I had a similar situation when I was put on permanent sick a year before my retirement date. The DWP immediately pounced, made me cash in my small private pension a year early with all the losses to the pot that entailed and when I got it they deducted the 'extra income' from what they were paying me under one section of my benefits. I got on to Gordon Prentice about this and he forced an explanation out of the DWP for me. Like you, I had fallen foul of the small print in the rules and what they did was legal but grossly unfair. Gordon apologised to me, sent me all the paperwork and later raised a question in the House pointing out the unfairness of the practice. It never made any difference but at least I had the satisfaction of having tried. (It all worked out OK in the end, I got a good annuity offer that increased by 3% compound interest each year. That was 20 years ago and I am now in front of the game. I was very lucky, talk to Tiz about the situation now.)
Again I had a similar situation when I was at Lancaster and LCC denied me support for my children as it was 'discretionary'. I went down the same route and eventually, because he was Education Minister at the time Rhodes Boyson raised it in a Parliamentary Question, The LCC was forced to admit that I qualified and under pressure gave me the support for three years. So sometimes it does work but in that case it was only because LCC had put in writing that I didn't qualify when I actually did. If they had told the truth they could still legally have refused to pay.
So it pays to fight!

[PanBiker]

Suzanne was good to her word. I received written confirmation of my pension calculations accompanied by an explanation of how they arrive at the figures this morning.

[Stanley]

[Stanley]

A bit of history for you. Have you ever heard of the 'Big Winders' in connection with the start of the pension? See https://www.historyireland.com/volume-25/on-this-day-33/ and read the entry for the 1st of January 1909.

[PanBiker]

5/- a week, those were the days.

[Stanley]

It was an interesting period in history. Incidentally, if you dig into the history Germany was the first nation to introduce the concept of support in old age under Bismark. See THIS short article.

[Phil]

I thinks that the lass from Leeds will be from Lowehouse and she works at Burnley Pension Centre, I have to say that I taught her well!!!

[Stanley]

If it was you are right Phil. A job well done!

[Stanley]

See THIS article about the conundrum facing the Chancellor as the next rise in pensions will be a record because of the lock with earnings. Any guesses as to what Rishi will do?

[plaques]

Rather than on a yearly basis he will use 2019 pre-covid years as the benchmark and smooth the curve as a mathematical aberration. This would show that in the years earnings went down in truth they actually went up and what we are seeing now didn't really happen. Am I making myself clear???