POLITICS CORNER

[Tizer]

This could be interesting. Trump makes fun of him and calls him `Little Michael' but Bloomberg has 17 times more money at his disposal than does Trump...
`US election 2020: Michael Bloomberg joins race for White House' LINK

[plaques]

I wonder if the asian population did not vote in the referendum, they might in the general election, but the quantity of low paid/ no paid people in the relatively poor quality council/housing pendle properties from Nelson / Colne and northwards dont to me seem inclined to identify with labour policies or people.

I'm not too sure that the Asian population don't seem inclined to identify with labour policies or people it may be that we, the older generation whites, don't get involved with their communities so it is us that's out of touch. The odd few I've come into contact with are very politically minded and could be considered as Labour party activists.

The 2017 general election in Pendle gave the following results.
Andrew Stephenson, Con, Majority: 1,279. Turnout: 69%

Full results
Summary: 2017 and changes 2015–2017

Candidate Party Votes______Vote____ (%)____Change (%)
Andrew Stephenson__Con__ 21,986__ 49.0___1.8
Wayne Blackburn____Lab___20,707__46.2___11.2
Gordon Lishman * ___LD______941____2.1___-1.2
Brian Parker * ______BNP _____718____1.6____1.6
Ian Barnett * _______Green____502____1.1____-1.2
* Lost deposits.
The swing to Labour of 11.2% could have come from several sources the general opinion is it came from new young voters which may have included many Asians. 2017 Election Results

[Stanley]

I can't see Moon Face surviving the next election. If he does it will be a tragedy as he is a useless MP unless you are a business man wanting an MP on your lunch photo opportunity. If so, he's your man!
I agree Tiz. He's a late entry but he has plenty of resources and is a liberal. Money talks in US elections.

[plaques]

Today's headline splash is Labour's spending plans. The Tories have thrown one of their dead cats on the table to deflect from their disastrous start to their election campaign. Spending plans are always open to interpretation, a typical example is if you borrow to create an asset are you in debt or is the bottom line in balance, think house purchase, all very confusing. In Mrs May's 2017 campaign there was a lot of talk about the cost of care. It became evident that unless you had become involved in the system the bottom line of who exactly pays for different care packages was not well understood. The Tories decided not to try to explain the workings but to leave people in ignorance otherwise the nasty party would be exposed again. One of the cornerstones of Tory thinking is that the 'working class' is largely uneducated and don't read for themselves so its up the elite to do the thinking for these uneducated masses and to present the interpretation that fits their agenda. All part of the brain washing exercise.

[Tizer]

One of the cornerstones of Tory thinking is that the 'working class' is largely uneducated and don't read for themselves so its up the elite to do the thinking for these uneducated masses and to present the interpretation that fits their agenda. All part of the brain washing exercise.

I've just written about `whitesplaining' on the Dialect thread. Perhaps your example could be `Torysplaining'.
As for `spending plans', I'm ignoring anything the two main parties try to tell me about their spending plans. They're in a bidding war and making it up as they go along. Pie in the sky. It'll all be forgotten after the election and plenty of excuses will be ready in case anyone does remember. Unfortunately, in the meantime there are too many gullible people who will believe it all.

I noticed this report...
`UK's credit rating could be downgraded, says Moody's' LINK
...but it set my mind on a different track. All these financial, economic and political problems relating to Brexit are the fault of those who want to leave the EU. They can all be wiped away by simply staying in the EU. And yet it's the Brexiteers who call the Remainers traitors!

[Tripps]

I've mentioned Heidi Allen a few times - indulge me .

She flounced out a while ago saying that she'd had enough of the cruel nasty world of politics..
I've looked at her twitter now and then since she retired from the field, but never got past the first post announcing her departure which invites us to read her letter in which she explained why she is quitting politics. There is now no means of reading her letter from twitter that I can detect.

I discovered today that this top post is 'pinned' and there's a lot more beneath it that I hadn't noticed. Until today. . . .

She's only gone and started another political alliance / pseudo party. Launched just last Wednesday 6th Nov 2019, and called 'Unite to Remain', with the Liberals, Plaid Cymru, Greens etc.

I think that's a clear case of 'Heidisplaining' and must be the shortest flounce in history?

Puzzled of S. Cambs.

[Whyperion]

I hadn't noticed the Pendle Result was so close, maybe the unite to remain could be handy if LD and GRN stand aside for Labour. Ideally Labour need to win on Merit. Thinking about the outgone Speaker if he wanted to avoid Brexit he ended up merely delaying it if Boris has his way, it is going to be a continued problem if the Government will generally set the Agenda I dont know if there was any other route to getting the house to consider Boris' deal with an aim to a suitable act of leaving, which I think I would have preferred to the potential of a large Tory Majority - Present Poll Indications are putting voting intentions at Tory 39% Lab 26% LibDem17% GRN 6% and Brexit 10%. I Assume if no brexit candidate they are unlikely to vote for any other candidate so percentages uplift accordingly. Assuming that there is variations around seats I see a general England Result that returns still Tory as a majority of seat numbers but enough for outright? Too close to call, Lib Will increase their total number of seats is the only prediction I can see being a reality.

[Stanley]

Very true P. I keep saying that what they don't accept is that some of us are smarter than they are!
Tiz, I noted the Moody report as well, they have been on the case issuing warnings for a while.
I agree about the fact that all discussions of spending plans are flim flam until manifestos and costed budgets are issued. Until then there is no basis for them apart from headline grabbing and I think you are all right, the Tories are in trouble and they know it. Expect nothing but lies and obfuscation until December 11.
As for Heidi David, I did hear her earlier on say that though not standing she was going to be active in politics. I suspect she is not alone, much will be going on behind closed doors as usual....

[plaques]

Whyperion, Statistical examination of voting trends has moved to a different level compared to the days when gangs of people rove about shopping malls asking how you would vote. Today the sophistication is at degree level and above. People who practice psephology are called psephologists.(pebble counters?). Its been mentioned several times on One Guy that Big Data is now controlling our lives, where we shop, what we buy, and all internet interaction that you never give two thoughts about. The elephant in the room of biblical proportions, to quote the current catch phrase, is Facebook where comments are shared by relatively small groups, usually the younger people, which is giving the pollsters a big headache because they are shut out of this loop. In spite of political parties spending (£)thousands on targeted phone advertising they still don't know what is going on.
Polling statistics are reasonably accurate for established static groups but fall down big style in the more flexible media that the younger people are using today.

[Stanley]

Just heard the news that Farage has pulled out of contesting Tory seats. Supposed to be under pressure from inside the Brexit Party but being a suspicious bugger I wonder what the pay back is.

[Tripps]

There were rumours he had been offered a peerage. I think this is him accepting it. He'll need somewhere to have his long lunches when Brussels is no longer an option.

[PanBiker]

Aye he is only fielding candidates in Labour held seats.

[Stanley]

That could backfire if they split the Tory vote. I sincerely hope so.
I noted Sajid Javez assuring us that the economy is doing well when announcing that we had escaped falling into depression. The man is deluded and should go away and look at the figures since 2010. We are declining at a steady rate and anything under 2.5% growth is actually going backwards. +.03% doesn't cut it! (And that was due to unusual factors like the end of early shut-downs for maintenance in the motor industry.)
A letter from Corbyn to Johnson criticising him for saying that the floods aren't a national emergency and saying that if it was happening in Surrey all the stops would be pulled out has had an effect. It's been announced that Johnson will chair a meeting of COBRA this morning. JC seems to have hit a nerve. (LINK)

[plaques]

Which ever the way you look at it a vote for Farage's Brexit party or Johnson's 'Get Brexit Done' Tory party is a vote for Trump. Seeing Farage standing side by side with trump brings back images of Blair with G W Bush prior to the Iraq invasion. Not a good combination to be following. Johnson's fantastic Brexit withdrawal deal is just what it says on the tin 'Fantasy'. Mr Bean Gove has already admitted the result may lead to no deal scenario where we crash out. Trump wins again. By having two parties pushing the same agenda we have in affect doubled the money available for the Tory party to spend on electioneering. Farage and Johnson are out of the same mould with little sympathy for the lower orders. Johnson's Doncaster is looking like a replay of Mrs May's Grenfell, having to be told what to do. I suspect the younger Facebook generation will spot this subterfuge and hopefully get out in sufficient numbers to put the older tribal generation to shame,

[Stanley]

They are saying now that the Cobra meeting was arranged before the Corbyn letter was received.... Really?
Did you hear the the Tory berk on Today 'defending' the fact that the intelligence report hasn't been published? Even more obvious that the latests Cummings doctrine is to ignore the questions and just keep talking about something else, preferably attacking Labour. It's boring and pathetic and if they think this will bring in swing voters they can forget it.

[Tizer]

They are saying now that the Cobra meeting was arranged before the Corbyn letter was received.... Really?

Why not really? Beware of viewing the world through glasses tinted with the colour of your favourite political party!

We've had at least five flyers from the LibDems through our letterbox in the last two weeks but nothing from any other party. Living here it's almost as if there is only one party!

[Tripps]

We've had at least five flyers from the LibDems through our letterbox in the last two weeks

Same here. they are formidable campaigners.

Interests me how decisions are reached in the Brexits. Looks to me that the only person involved in the decision to stand down half of his optimistic, hopeful, and paying, mugs candidates was one Nigel Farage. Democracy in action.

Labour adult education policy is interesting, from Shadow Minister Angela Rayner. Available for all, and totally free at the point of delivery is the aim.To be paid for by increasing tax on the top 5 % of earners and raising corporation tax.

PS. She also said the day after they came to office - all student tuition fees would be abolished. I wonder if that will affect the way students might vote?

[Whyperion]

Not certain if all the Labour comittments to extra spending are in yet. apparently it works out at £8000 per household per year extra over a 5 year parliamentary term. I doubt it can all be spent, I would expect at least £6000 back in taxes though out of it so not a large amount of spending, if spent correctly.

[Stanley]

Tiz. your warning is quite right but Johnson showed no signs of regarding it as an emergency on Monday night and Cobra wasn't arranged until the following day.
None of labour's 'plans for extra spending' are in place and won't be until the manifesto and Grey Book are published.
Only flier through my door so far is Council bin dates for 2020.

[plaques]

Spending plans and black holes a common theme in the current election campaign yet every time anybody mentions Trident the debate is shut down. Most people know that our 'independent' nuclear deterrent isn't independent at all.
Quote: So we are being asked to spend around £100bn – or 12 times the Tories’ NHS EXTRA funding centrepiece – to maintain and replace our “independent” nuclear strike capability – which does not exist.
Get rid of Trident and there is enough money to pay for all the social improvements that the country demands. Of course that will leave us open for Russia for example to bomb us out of existence without us knowing that we have done the same to them. China could do the same but find it more convenient to be like America and buy the UK and its population assets up instead.
Its about time we started thinking a bit more logically about what we are doing rather than keep living in the past.

[Tizer]

A BBC Reality Check article on more misinformation. It's a bigger version of the type of claim made by Boris when he said an EU rule was ruining our smoked fish industry but the truth was that it was rule passed by the UK government.
`Brexit: Claims about EU tax rules fact-checked' https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/50168357

[Stanley]

Couldn't agree with you more P. I have been making that argument for years.
As for 'misinformation', it is so rife now that we can't take anything said by any politician at face value.
My solution, as I intimated when we were discussing the voting, is to go back to what I believe the core values and principles of each movement is and decide on that basis. I'm not even certain that I can depend on my own assessments now but it's the best I have.

[Stanley]

'Hanging and Flogging' Pritel has jumped into the immigration debate. One thing is certain, May's 'hostile climate' will be alive and well if she gets control.

[Tizer]

Laura Kuenssberg's take on the current election...LINK
`General election 2019: Old loyalties fracturing in strange campaign'

I keep hearing the Brexiteers banging on about the 17 million people (51.9% of the voters) who want us to leave the EU. Hearing it again yesterday another thought crossed my mind. Only 72% of the electorate turned out to vote in 2016. A lot has happened since then. What do the other 28% (~13 million adults) now want? If we could coax them into making a decision would they say `Get it over with and leave at last' or `Forget it. Stay in. Better the devil you know.'?

[Tripps]

Listening to Caroline Lucas the leader of the Green Party on Radio LBC. It seemed to come as something of a surprise to her when a caller reminded her of her own party's drug policy.
It's a bit long winded, but worth reading to get the gist. They seem to have given it a lot of thought.

DR317 A Green government will implement the following mechanisms for the legal regulation of drugs:
Medical Prescription – doctors and suitably qualified health professionals will be able to prescribe drugs such as heroin to those who use drugs.
Specialist Pharmacy – specially qualified pharmacists will be able to dispense supplies of recreational drugs such as powder cocaine or amphetamines over the counter to people who wish to use the drugs for recreational purposes. Drugs will be dispensed after a short consultation during which the person who uses the drug is given safety information and directed to support services if required.
Licensed Sales – outlets will be licensed by local councils to sell drugs such as herbal cannabis or alcohol to people who wish to use the drugs for recreational purposes. Licensees will be subject to regulation on opening hours, quantity, strength and type of drug sold, age and intoxication level of the purchaser. All drugs sold in licensed outlets will be subject to minimum unit pricing.
Licensed Premises – venues will be licensed by local councils to sell drugs such as alcohol and low-strength MDMA to people who wish to use drugs for recreational purposes for consumption on the premises. Licensees will be subject to regulation on location, external signage, opening hours, quantity, strength and type of drug sold, age and intoxication level of the purchaser. All drugs sold in licensed premises will be subject to minimum unit pricing.
Unlicensed Sales – low-risk drugs such as caffeine and coca tea which are suitable for sale will be made available in unlicensed shops and venues and subject to food and drink legislation.

DR318 Local Authority licensing committees will be responsible for granting licenses for the supply of recreational drugs using the above mechanisms. Committees will be guided by the following principles in their decision-making:

Promotion of public safety
Promotion of public health
Protection of children and vulnerable adults from harm
Protection of the natural environment
Promotion of a diverse and inclusive cultural environment
Promotion of a thriving local economy by supporting local producers
Prevention of public nuisance, crime and disorder.

4. Drug-specific policy (for reform of legislative framework)
Alcohol

DR401 Alcoholic drinks are fermented liquors, e.g. wine, beer and spirits, containing the intoxicating agent ethyl alcohol. The Green Party recognises the special historical status that alcohol has with respect to other drugs in England and Wales but considers many aspects of our cultural attitude to drinking to be harmful to the individual and to society.

DR402 A Green government will:

Regulate alcohol in line with the regulation of other drugs
Increase alcohol duties to reflect the cost of harm caused by alcohol use on society
Reduce VAT on alcohol sold in pubs and restaurants in order to promote small businesses and incentivise safer alcohol consumption in communal settings
Reduce drink-drive limits to 50mg of alcohol in every 100ml of blood.

Amphetamines

DR403 Amphetamines are synthetic stimulants that speed up the body and its functions and suppress appetite. In England and Wales amphetamine (speed) is a popular drug in nightlife and party settings.

DR404 A Green government will:

Make amphetamine available in fixed dosages at fixed prices to people who wish to use the drug for recreational purposes for personal use solely through the specialist pharmacy mechanism
Require that specialist pharmacies provide full information on support services and safe use information, including guidelines on safe injecting
Provide medical support and therapy for people whose use becomes problematic.

Cannabis

DR405 Cannabis contains cannabidiol (CBD) and tetrahydrocannabinol (THC), which produce a range of psychological and physiological effects. Since 2000, many governments in the world have decriminalised or legalised cannabis, with little evidence of increased use or harmful effects to the population, and generally positive health and social outcomes. Cannabis has a long history of use as a medicine. Medical cannabis is approved for use in the UK although access is currently limited to the private market.

DR406 A Green government will:

Grant licences for Cannabis Social Clubs, premises where members cultivate, prepare and consume cannabis for recreational purposes (see above)
Grant licenses for small businesses to sell recreational cannabis at fixed prices for consumption on or off the premises
Create commercial licences for co-operatives and social enterprises to cultivate cannabis to be sold either directly to the consumer (licensed sales) or to manufacturers of other cannabis-based products
Make provision for home use and cultivation, including a limit on the number of plants permitted per household and restrictions on secondary for-profit sales
Ensure that laboratory-tested cannabinoid content is clearly labelled on any commercially available flowers as well as ingestible and topical product such as edibles, oils, tinctures and balms
Make herbal cannabis available on NHS prescription, produced by government-employed cultivators
Apply to cannabis smoking the same restrictions as tobacco smoking
Ensure that all commercially available cannabis products have a minimum of 1% Cannabidiol.

Cocaine

DR407 Cocaine is a stimulant that produces feelings of euphoria, confidence, energy and alertness. It is produced from coca leaves grown in the Andes region. The Green Party recognises that any attempt to address the human rights, development, health and environmental fallout from the prohibitionist approach to drugs must adopt a new approach to the production, trade and use of cocaine and other coca products on a global scale.

DR408 A Green government will:

Make powder cocaine available in fixed dosages at fixed prices to people who wish to use the drug for recreational purposes for personal use only through the specialist pharmacy model
Make lower-strength cocaine products such as drinks available at fixed prices from specialist pharmacies to provide lower dose options, thus absorbing some of the demand for cocaine in a safer way
Fund professional medical treatment for people who use cocaine problematically, along with social and psychological support
Introduce direct partnerships between the UK government and coca farming co-operatives in main areas of production, notably parts of South America, that guarantee a fair and sustainable income for producer communities and a sustainable supply of coca and cocaine for recreational, medical and other uses in the UK.

Crack Cocaine

DR409 Crack is manufactured from powder cocaine via a simple process that can be done in the home. It is normally smoked or injected, often in conjunction with heroin.

DR410 A Green government will:

Explore options for piloting making crack cocaine available on NHS prescription from medical professionals for use under medical supervision in a clinic, similar to a Swiss-style Heroin Assisted Treatment clinic, as maintenance therapy for individuals who are unable or unwilling to reduce their use.
Implement Heroin Assisted Treatment (see above) for people who use both heroin and crack cocaine and for whom other treatments have not worked.
Introduce Overdose Prevention Centres (OPCs, see above) – venues where people can use crack cocaine, with free supplies of sterile injecting equipment, staffed by health professionals trained to promote maximum safety for people who use the drug.
Fund professional medical treatment for people who use crack cocaine problematically, along with social and psychological support, to help them to engage as fully as possible in society.

GHB

DR411 GHB (gamma hydroxybutyric acid) is a depressant that acts on the body in a way similar to alcohol. In lower doses it also has euphoric and aphrodisiac properties.

DR412 A Green government will:

Make GHB available in fixed dosages to people who wish to use the drug for recreational purposes for personal use only through specialist pharmacies
Require that clubs, bars, saunas and other venues have full safety information on GHB use and potential risks for patrons, emphasising the risks of combining GHB with alcohol and of sharing drinks with strangers
Provide medical support and therapy for people who use the drug problematically.

Heroin

DR413 Heroin is the common name for the drug diamorphine, a strong painkiller which is commonly used in medical practice in the NHS. As a recreational drug it is usually smoked, snorted or injected.

DR414 A Green government will:

Make heroin available on NHS prescription from medical professionals as maintenance therapy for individuals who are unable or unwilling to reduce their use
Introduce Overdose Prevention Centres (OPCs; see above)
Fund professional medical treatment for people who use heroin problematically, along with social and psychological support, to help those people to engage as fully as possible in society
Build a strong development component into the opioid industry to protect the interests of traditional opium-growing regions, for example by introducing direct partnerships between the UK government and opium farmers in central and south-east Asia to guarantee a sustainable income for farming communities.

Ketamine

DR415 Ketamine is a strong dissociative anaesthetic that also has psychedelic effects. It is used widely around the world as an anaesthetic agent and since the late 20th century has been popular among people seeking spiritual and other psychedelic experiences, as well as on the club scene. Ketamine is typically sniffed or snorted but can also be injected.

DR416 A Green government will:

End all unwarranted restrictions on ketamine for medical research
Make ketamine available in fixed dosages to people who wish to use the drug for recreational purposes for personal use only through specialist pharmacies
Provide medical support and therapy for people who use the drug problematically.

MDMA

DR417 MDMA, popularly known as ecstasy, is a stimulant which produces empathogenic and occasionally hallucinogenic effects. It is typically ingested orally as a tablet or powder and is popular on the club and rave scenes. There is strong evidence of MDMA’s value as a medical treatment for some mental health disorders.

DR418 A Green government will:

End all unwarranted restrictions on MDMA for medical research
Make MDMA available on prescription to patients under the direct supervision of licensed healthcare professionals in therapies where benefits have been proven by medical research
Make MDMA available in fixed dosages to people who wish to use the drug for recreational purposes through specialist pharmacies
Grant licenses to venues, festivals and other events to sell fixed-dose products containing low doses of MDMA for consumption on the premises
Require that license holders be able to demonstrate that staff are trained to provide supportive care for individuals who are intoxicated
Provide medical support and therapy for people who use the drug problematically.

Mephedrone



DR419 Mephedrone is a stimulant with psychoactive properties. It appeared on the UK club scene in the early 21st century and quickly became one of the most popular recreational drugs.

DR420 A Green government will:

Make mephedrone available in fixed dosages to people who wish to use the drug for recreational purposes for personal use only through specialist pharmacies
Provide medical support and therapy for people who use the drug problematically.

Methamphetamine

DR421 Methamphetamine has the same effects as amphetamine but is more potent and has a longer duration of action. It is more associated with problematic use because it can be smoked (unlike amphetamine sulphate/hydrochloride) as well as injected/snorted/taken orally. The rapid onset of smoked use increases risks including potential to develop compulsive or dependent patterns of use.

DR422 A Green government will:

Make methamphetamine available on NHS prescription from medical professionals as maintenance therapy
Provide Overdose Prevention Centres (OPCs; see above)
Fund professional medical treatment for people who use methamphetamine problematically, along with social and psychological support, to help them to engage as fully as possible in society.

New psychoactive substances



DR423 Driven by prohibitionist policies towards existing drugs, new psychoactive substances (NPS) have been developed, marketed and distributed since the early 21st century. NPS cover a vast spectrum, from almost harmless to potentially catastrophically dangerous (for example, some of the fentanyl analogues).



DR424 A Green government will:

Make all new drugs subject to research
Implement risk-appropriate licensed sales dependent upon a baseline of risk data.

Nicotine

DR425 Nicotine is the principal psychoactive drug found in tobacco and has both stimulant and sedative effects on the brain. Since 2000, the UK government has introduced regulations on the supply and use of tobacco, which have dramatically improved health outcomes. Despite this, cigarette smoking remains the biggest preventable cause of death in Britain and worldwide.

DR426 A Green government will:

Prohibit all marketing by private companies of products containing nicotine
Allow the NHS to promote nicotine-containing products as part of health promotion initiatives to reduce smoking
Extend plain packaging policies to all products containing nicotine
Make tobacco and nicotine-containing products available at licensed outlets only
Extend the smoking ban to publicly accessible outdoor areas where children congregate such as playgrounds, school gates and youth centres.


Psychedelics



DR427 Psychedelic drugs have the effect of altering a person’s state of consciousness and perception of visual and auditory stimuli. Because of the effect that psychedelic drugs have in enabling the person who uses them to see things from a different perspective, they have huge potential as part of therapeutic regimes for mental illnesses and addiction.

DR428 A Green government will:

Make substantial public funding available for research into psychedelic drugs as adjunctive therapies for mental illness and addiction
Make psychedelic drugs available in fixed dosages to people who wish to use psychedelics for recreational purposes for personal use through specialist pharmacies
Require that specialist pharmacies provide full information on support services to people who use psychedelics
Grant licenses to venues and festivals and other events to sell fixed doses of psychedelic drugs for consumption on the premises, and require license holders to demonstrate that staff are trained to provide supportive care for individuals who are intoxicated.