OneGuyFromBarlick

We were lying in this morning (Sunday) after our decorating yesterday but the phone rang at 7.50am. It was a carer standing outside Mrs Tiz's parent's house in London and wanting to know what to do because the house was in darkness and they weren't answering the door. We had to tell her that of course the house is in darkness, they don't get up until about 8.30 or 9.00 even on weekdays let alone Sunday. If the door bell goes when they are in bed it will take them ages to be able to get out of bed and get to the door. They both have serious mobility problems. If they could get out of bed and get about easily they wouldn't need carers!

Mrs Tiz rang her Dad later and found out why they needed an even longer lie in this morning. At 5.30am Dad fell and couldn't get up so he phoned his other daughter who lives in High Wycombe and she had to drive to London, get him up and then drive home again. He should have phoned for an ambulance to come and help but was too embarrassed because they had had to do that a few days ago when Mum fell and couldn't get up (the ambulance men had been cheerful and helpful and there was no suggestion that they were wasting the Service's time).

So much care and effort. I hope my old Sunday School teacher was right and there are Treasures in Heaven!

If you are right on this Stanley my Dave will be at the front of the queue on how he looks after me. Eileen

Eileen, if it isn't it's definitely not fair!

Tizer. doesn't your Dad's local authority have a telecare or similar service . Mum's borough has an independent service , part funded by the local council , with radio comms link to an internal phone unit also now linked by them to the smoke alarms, the base and visiting workers are pleasant and helpful even if there are false alarms - overboiling the veggies or overtoasting spuds in the microwave and she has recommended the service to some of her friends as well , as the cost is means-tested it varies from a few pounds a month to about a pound a day. Pendle also has an award winning similar service covering its areas. They can route through to fire or ambulance services as required too.

Whippy, thanks for your concern and suggestions. Such services and gadgets are available, both in this region for my Dad and in Mrs Tiz's parent's area too, but the problem is not availability but willingness of said parents to accept them. My Dad just says `No!', he seems to regard it as a weakness to have such a thing! Mother-in-law has a device to press for help but father-in-law won't have one; and when he fell down the other day she didn't know. We and the carers can't convince them to change. They no longer seem to realise how much distress they are causing their relatives.

"They no longer seem to realise how much distress they are causing their relatives."
That is exactly the problem with my mum as well Tiz. You can understand it, but it doesn't make it any easier to deal with. Mum is always desperate "to get out". It doesn't matter how many people come to see her....if they are not taking her to the shops she can do without them! With the weather being bad her lunch club and exercise class have been cancelled...Mum cant understand why... and the lovely neighbour who kindly takes Mum to Sainsbury's on a Thursday is already getting criticised (only to me I hope) because she is not keen on driving in the snow.
Mum has an alarm that she says she wears if she goes out in the garden, otherwise it is kept on her walker.."so it's always with me". I can't get through to her that she is going to fall when she has left the walker in another room.
She now informs me that her carers tell her she must never go into a nursing home because they are terrible places. I cant get over to her that if she were to take the step now we could get her into a lovely residential home...

My dad had a number of alarms for various things but never used them properly. He refused to wear his personal community alarm, just saying it was in the kitchen if he needed it. As I said if he needed it he couldn't get to the kitchen. It fell on deaf ears. His answer to everything was to call the police ! Eventually the Community Police called on him to check he was ok. It was a real worry at times

It perhaps shows how things have changed. At one time the police saw things like that as part of their function. When my dad died in hospital we had no 'phone and a young constable was sent round late at night to let us know. I finished up comforting him, it was the first time he'd done it and he was overwhelmed.

My former mother-in-law recently died ( aged in her 80s)
She always wore one of those panic buttons on a chain around her neck, had a key safe outside the front door for emergency access, had a mobile phone and three other handsets in various locations, with all her emergency contacts on speed dial. Family members rang her every day, as did the Red Cross to check on her.
All excellent ideas, though in the end they would not have done her any good.
She died mid-sentence while sat chatting to a friend. (Bilateral pulmonary emboli.)

You can only do what you can. Don't beat yourself up that you can't do any more.

Marilyn wrote:You can only do what you can. Don't beat yourself up that you can't do any more.

Sage words Maz, thanks. We are gradually reaching that destination but it's a rocky road to get there. An extra problem is that I've never `got along' with my Dad, he has very strong, fixed ideas, is intolerant of anyone not like himself and has never had close friends - if anyone failed to agree with something he said he would simply ignore them. Now that he gets confused and forgets a lot it's even harder to `get along' with him. For instance he's insisting that the doctor will have to let him continue driving when he has an assessment next month and therefore I should fit his car with a new battery in preparation for this. I'm refusing to spend money and time on it until we see the result of the assessment. (One of his arguments is "I've passed three driving tests" - yes, one in the RAF, one in South Africa and one in Britain, but they were all in the 1940s.)

I understand your concern, and that your father has to pass/ fail that test under his own steam.
Unfortunately, along with rights come responsibility, and the worry of anyone he could hurt as a result of his driving.
I wish there were some other way we could revoke driving licences...hubby and I had a relative in his MID 90s (!) who drove a ' death trap' of a car, had no money to repair it and felt it a waste of money to do so...every time he visited, we would cover our eyes and hold our breath when he pulled out from our driveway into the passing traffic. He would disappear over the hill to a prolonged salute of tooting horns. It was simply terrifying.
Yet...he passed a YEARLY examination! ( the saving grace being that he could see ok when tested but was as deaf as a post)

Result was he eventually gave the driving away of his own decision, then he died about a week later...phew!

Care Homes , and warden assisted accomodation , do seem to come in a variety of abilities , I quite like the Anchor branded ones , and I think the one in Thornton has quite a good reputation , but because its in Skipton and Craven , Pendle wont fund any element the council is expected to fund , and the care home an elderly friend in Barnoldswick was sent to in Colne I feel did not do the best they could for her , following on from her discharge from hospital.

I note this morning on BBC Breakfast Current Shadow Health Secretary Andy Burnham has come up with the idea of combining local council care budgets and national NHS budgets in response to an aging population, which seems a possible sensible idea , citing Torbay where people whom have a dedicated care worker or team , whom then have to go into hospital for treatment , the known carer accompanies , visits and is involved in the discharge process , which seems close to the best reasonable outcome.

Tizer , I was going to suggest that you sell the contact systems to father-in-law as being the 21st century communications solution and a good way to keep up with modern systems, he may not go with it. Of course the systems wont necessarily recognise all situtations , I think some smart devices can sense falls and non-movement over time and possibly be linked to heart rate monitoring, but they are a sensible in-home monitoring of vulnerable persons.

What I would like to see is some sort of compulsory contract system in place ( trouble is I am not sure what age it should start as some drivers are 'past' being responsible by age 70 and others would be offended by the intrusion...but let us, for the sake of brevity, say Age 65?)
The contract would be a ten point check list given to four parties...the Motor Registrars, Your GP, Yourself and a loved one ( son, daughter, friend etc). In this scenario an elderly person would at least feel 50% of the testers would be on their side.
Out of a potential score of 40 ( if each of the four people - including yourself- gave a positive answer in your favour) let us say you had to pass with a minimum of 25 positive response points to enable you to have 'restricted driving rights' ( say during daylight hours and no further than 60ks from home). Above 30 positive response points, greater rights.
Your driving restrictions would show on your licence, which would be renewed every year.

If you capped the driving at 65 Maz you would knock on the head a lot of working blokes. Lots of folk have to work until their late 60's now. I know it was only an example, I think discretionary tests after 70 would be better but any system introduced would be a nightmare to administer and would put extra burden on the police who are being squeezed on manpower anyway. I would think any such restrictions would be virtually unenforceable. We can't make people wear their seatbelts or stop them using their mobile phones and these requirements have been with us for years.

The problem here is that no one wants to actually say "yes you are OK to drive". There would be lawsuits when it all went wrong. After my recent hip op, the book said do not drive for six weeks. After this time, I asked the GP was I fit to drive. He said "that's up to you, drive when you feel you are ready". The book also said "advise your insurance company of your situation. I did that, and they said they did not need to know - "you can drive so long as no one has said you cannot drive".

People would soon get used to it Panny, if it were LAW that everyone over 65 had to be tested yearly and then may have to work within the framework of a restricted licence. If they made it a blanket rule that absolutely everyone's licence expired yearly and impose heavy fines for those who ignore the rules ( impound the car for example like they do here with hoon drivers! We crush their cars too! We don't care if it is under finance, or they need it for work...should have thought about that before hoon driving!)
The onus and responsibility of licence renewal by the due date is solely the responsibility of the driver, as is the compulsory medical exam .
Pretty soon we would all fall in line and get the tests done.

And I don't agree that people wouldn't bother or that it is too hard to police. You will learn the lesson pretty quickly when the car gets impounded!

Driving is not a right. It is a privilege. ( which can be revoked so easily).
We need checks and balances for older drivers.

You all know what my attitude to driving is, get rid of the car and licence as soon as you don't need it. However, so many people live in relatively isolated places and can't walk to the shops. Big problem.
Tiz, I know about the old dog/young dog syndrome but happily my dad and I saw sense and became friends when I was about 40. I suspect we were lucky.

Father-in-law has given up driving and given his Ford Fusion to younger daughter (very useful because she's a health visitor and needs a very reliable car) and she's given her old Golf to her son (the geologist) who has just returned from working abroad. Mother-in-law fell over again last night and the emergency services had to be called out and she's in hospital. I wonder if there's a limit to how many times they can be called out for this sort of thing before they say that the person needs to live elsewhere?

You'd think that they would start to ask questions and perhaps initiate an assessment. Worrying stuff.... I'm lucky in that I don't have any responsibility except for myself. You wouldn't believe how careful I am on the stairs! (It's the last three steps that get you!)

We got a call yesterday from our Warwickshire Police Liaison Officer, PC Sharon Coldrick. She is coming up to see us on Monday to get family background information on Daniel that can be presented to the Coroner. We think this is the last bit of information that is needed before all the reports and evidence will be submitted. All the other reports are finalised so the inquest should follow hopefully sometime next month.

Keep your chin up - once the inquest is over you can concentrate on remembering Daniel and the memories you have of him. Thinking of you often knowing how you feel.

Thank you Moh, were not looking forward to the inquest but do accept that it is a necessary step that we need to get the right side of. We will be going down to Ghyll Church this afternoon to have a look at Dan's cremation memorial stone that we have been informed by the monumental masons has now been installed.

Inquests can be long drawn out due to the discovery and disclosure process and it's wearing. Janet was in court for three weeks apart from the time taken gathering evidence. I forget now how long that was but certainly months.

I hope it all goes as smoothly as possible Ian, you don't need any extra stress.

Mrs Tiz's parents are both in hospital again. I mentioned above about Mum going in on the Sunday; she was out on Monday but fell again almost immediately and was once again rescued by the emergency services and hauled off to hospital. Dad then became unwell and couldn't get out of bed and ended up also being taken to hospital in an ambulance. He's expected to come home this evening but she's staying in until some tests have been done on her heart.

Yesterday I took my Dad to town to get his pension and some food from the supermarket but the town was gridlocked and we had to abandon the trip. Then found his central heating has failed and I couldn't get it sorted, so it means getting a plumber in. Next Wednesday I take Dad for his assessment with the GP to decide whether he can resume driving or not and also, on Monday, we take him for an optician's appointment for the same purpose. It's going to be difficult whichever way the decision goes. If he gets stopped from driving he's going to be very annoyed, but if he's allowed to continue we're going to be very worried. There's no doubt he could get into a car and drive it but the problem (which he won't accept exists) is the mental fuzziness and confusion - I can imagine him looking the wrong way when pulling out of a side road. I'm sure if you asked him he would tell you correctly, but I'm not confident he would always get it right now on the road. On Tuesday I take him to see an oncologist about deciding to have radiotherapy as a follow up to the operation last November and that could affect his abilities too, even if only temporary. I had to make a big fuss to get him the appointment this early, they were still going to leave it for weeks. I insisted that since we'd been told the purpose of the radiotherapy was to prevent any cancer cells spreading, it must be done at an early date or it would be too late. They grudgingly admitted that was true.